tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2660089177097719300.post8632390542702878201..comments2024-03-16T18:32:15.171-07:00Comments on Writing About Writing (And Occasionally Some Writing): Ongoing Comments From "Changing the Creepy Guy Narrative"Chris Brecheenhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/07819138776404280633noreply@blogger.comBlogger39125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2660089177097719300.post-19551499653217134982017-04-06T08:26:41.912-07:002017-04-06T08:26:41.912-07:00ROFL!! As a middle-aged woman who is no longer hit...ROFL!! As a middle-aged woman who is no longer hit on in public (usually), I hope I have an opportunity to do the same thing sometime should the opportunity occur. Although being female, I should probably only try it on a very young person who would be repelled by the thought - Society being what it is.<br /><br />DreamChaserhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12817952139972717289noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2660089177097719300.post-27824359863334111452016-05-25T07:47:27.323-07:002016-05-25T07:47:27.323-07:00It's interesting that men are defended and bec...It's interesting that men are defended and become incensed by the exact same claims. Treat a man like a rapist and NOT ALL MEN are like that. But suggest that a man should be able to restrain himself from hitting on someone who is literally begging him to stop and suddenly it's all about biology.<br /><br />Our biology certainly influences our behavior, but it does not determine it. Chris Brecheenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07819138776404280633noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2660089177097719300.post-82420723655134988422016-05-25T07:04:10.223-07:002016-05-25T07:04:10.223-07:00A late entry to the commentfest. Let me preface th...A late entry to the commentfest. Let me preface this by saying I have read your pinned post on FB and your blog on why you outed yourself as a feminist. Your writing is superb and thought provoking and I can certainly see where you are coming from. However, there is another spin on this story, reading the subtext, that may not make you feel so heroic. Do you believe that humans are animals? That we have evolved from apes? If so, do you think that some of our behaviours might be better explained with reference to our biological instincts around sex rather than culture? I do. I am interested in engaging with you in a discussion on this if you wish, but am happy to leave that thought hanging out there as the bait it is intended to be if you do not. Thank you.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13472010047186084065noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2660089177097719300.post-62945894572667381812014-07-24T13:21:53.930-07:002014-07-24T13:21:53.930-07:00It could be because you are a writer.. OR, that y...It could be because you are a writer.. OR, that you are possibly one of the greatest freaking men I have ever known in my entire life.. And I called it early too!! I am so thankful you checked your others folder and took a chance on adding one more "unknown" admirer!! ((:Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2660089177097719300.post-5878491009379539422013-08-01T09:52:14.240-07:002013-08-01T09:52:14.240-07:00I love gandersauce. Love it so much. Thank you f...I love gandersauce. Love it <i>so much.</i> Thank you for being gutsy enough to dish some out.<br /><br />Jenny IslanderAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2660089177097719300.post-88021523160506173842013-07-30T14:14:34.908-07:002013-07-30T14:14:34.908-07:00Bless you, OP. This actually happened to me /toda...Bless you, OP. This actually happened to me /today/ on the train - the man next to me trying quite blatantly to get my attention while I read with my headphones in my ears - and if more people were like you then I wouldn't have to worry about it ever happening again. A quote from this post passed my tumblr and I had to come and just say 'thank you', especially for putting this out there and for giving the guy a taste of his own medicine.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05113416438472178055noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2660089177097719300.post-34269582475357349822013-07-22T17:08:22.736-07:002013-07-22T17:08:22.736-07:00It's also transphobic, as douching is medicall...It's also transphobic, as douching is medically necessary for trans women who've transitioned. It's like using gay as an insult. Not cool.Foul-weather knitterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05042452080456997222noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2660089177097719300.post-36611361798333329212013-07-22T00:23:19.452-07:002013-07-22T00:23:19.452-07:00That's pretty awesome!That's pretty awesome!Chris Brecheenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07819138776404280633noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2660089177097719300.post-68659569539637591132013-07-22T00:22:58.296-07:002013-07-22T00:22:58.296-07:00Oddly enough, this seems to be a point of great co...Oddly enough, this seems to be a point of great contention because it reeks of "You need us!" overtones, and that bothers some people greatly. <br /><br />I just wonder if there's a way (on a societal level) to get past that point.Chris Brecheenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07819138776404280633noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2660089177097719300.post-10864373440031665012013-07-21T23:22:21.635-07:002013-07-21T23:22:21.635-07:00A douchebag is a tool of the patriarchy. Nothing w...A douchebag is a tool of the patriarchy. Nothing wrong with calling a misogynistic tool a douche.Annahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06380316362911210106noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2660089177097719300.post-76185661429202747452013-07-21T12:33:26.296-07:002013-07-21T12:33:26.296-07:00My husband came home with a story about watching a...My husband came home with a story about watching a bunch of teenagers on a bus catcall at a woman sitting in the front of the bus. He has the advantage of being 6' 10", so when he leaned forward and told the teens "Hey, that's my sister you're talking to" they listened. And when he insisted they go up and apologize to her, they listened then too. I never thought of his behavior as anything other than him stepping in when he saw something he thought was wrong, and a chance to screw with some obnoxious teenagers. That's the kind of guy he is, it's a big part of why I married him. He does have the advantage of size and being male, but I'd rather he be aware of those advantages and use them for good rather than simply ignore a wrong when he sees it. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2660089177097719300.post-79248620351401569802013-07-21T12:04:50.977-07:002013-07-21T12:04:50.977-07:00Thank you so much for this.
Once upon a time, I w...Thank you so much for this.<br /><br />Once upon a time, I was that looks-like-a-model young woman who could not go ANYWHERE without some guy hitting on her. It was grueling, and I cannot tell you how many times I was called a "bitch" or a "tease" or "frigid" simply because I did not wish to engage with a creepy total stranger at the gas station.<br /><br />But it's not just up to men to change things. Now that I am a merely attractive 40-something mother-of-two, I use myself as a "bitch barrier" between the creepy guy and the victim of his affections.<br /><br />Once on the London underground I squeezed myself into a half-seat between a drunken lout and the pretty young woman he was bothering. I made a point of sitting forward or back in my seat as he did, to be sure he couldn't speak around me. At first I just played White Zombie at full volume on my iPod, but eventually I relented and allowed him to speak to me. I rather enjoyed subtly belittling him until she left the train.<br /><br />Thank you for starting this dialogue. And thank you for taking action. Now I'm off to watch that TED talk!Dana Forlanohttp://www.danaforlano.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2660089177097719300.post-9485356214177036082013-07-20T16:13:47.146-07:002013-07-20T16:13:47.146-07:00George Takai wrote "In fact, 'the douche&...George Takai wrote "In fact, 'the douche' is an invention, by men, that tells women they need to wash out their vaginas to be truly clean - in other words a totally unnecessary and demeaning contraption. Logically, calling someone this would be no slight against women at all. "Mary Ann Starkhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05637259763824196944noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2660089177097719300.post-67001821792134205202013-07-20T09:42:54.386-07:002013-07-20T09:42:54.386-07:00Wow.
Just wow.
Your story was amazing enough, bu...Wow.<br /><br />Just wow.<br /><br />Your story was amazing enough, but this is just spectacular.<br /><br />I want to give you all the non-ironic cookies.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2660089177097719300.post-59172865430442397062013-07-20T09:14:33.574-07:002013-07-20T09:14:33.574-07:00I'm glad someone brought this particular criti...I'm glad someone brought this particular criticism over to this page because I answered it on the original page, but I think it's something like 550 comments down. So this is mostly the cut/paste of that (if it feels slightly discordant):<br /><br />I want to thank you for bringing this up in a way that I feel like I can respond to without descending into something ugly. I've erased some comments that brought this up in very nasty ways, but I really want to be clear that I deleted them due to how unkind they were. I'm erasing the vitriol, not the issue. The fact is that this is a conversation WORTH having.<br /><br />What rang in my head in that moment was a saying that I think was on a meme or something back a few months ago: "Homophobia is the fear that gay men will treat straight men the way some straight men treat women," or something like that, and so I can't say this was innocent of what you've brought up. I didn't set out to "be gay" or "act gay" so much as just give the guy a taste of unwanted attention, and show him what it felt like when someone wasn't getting the hint. The fact that I'm a guy and he was a guy means that spur of the moment choice came with its own package of implications. I tend to listen to a "critical mass" of progressive folks I respect when I'm not sure if I need to be called out, and they seemed pretty happy with my choice, but I never think my actions are above reproach.<br /><br />I actually welcome the larger discourse this seems to have created about narratives of homophobia. And in a large part I don't want to do anything but listen to that discussion--partially because it's not my place to tell anyone they aren't offended by my actions, and partially because I don't want to say something I'll regret in a moment of butthurt knee-jerk defense. Some people think my approach was perfectly illustrative of what he was doing to her and was EXACTLY the right thing to do. They have cheered that no other approach would have been quite as effective. Some have brought up the points you did and criticized it. Some have said that I should have asked the woman if she needed help and others have said that would be TOO white knighty. Some think I should just have talked to him; some think that would have probably caused a violent escalation. <br /><br />I think as a community we SHOULD discuss where the sweet spot is because it's tragic that someone might NOT do something for fear of causing PC offense. If every action is objectionable in some way then we have to consider the implications that it is possible that the overarching dialogue is perpetuating inaction. Hopefully within that crucible we come to some good progressive, socially responsible conclusions.<br /><br />But as a white, het, cis, able, male, I can't reasonably participate in a conversation about what is or isn't hurtful to marginalized groups. I can really only listen. So even though a lot of comments seem directed AT me for my part in this, I would honestly encourage people who feel this way to engage in that respectful discourse. <br /><br />And maybe we leave that table grumbling at the fact that no approach made everyone happy, but that we can all agree that doing SOMETHING is the right thing to do.Chris Brecheenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07819138776404280633noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2660089177097719300.post-84879305258874673332013-07-20T06:00:14.287-07:002013-07-20T06:00:14.287-07:00I saw this posted by a friend on Facebook, and her...I saw this posted by a friend on Facebook, and here's what I wrote:<br />Fascinating example of pro-feminist allying, cleverly confronting a guy harassing a woman on public transit. His response was clever, insightful, and as it turned out, seemingly very effective. I wonder though, because he knew that he was pushing what he rightly guessed were the homophobic buttons of the guy, how nonviolent is this approach? Another way of asking this is, I wonder if there's a risk that he was reinforcing homophobia in the guy he confronted, or was he challenging it? I'm glad he spoke up; I'm unsettled by the method.Sam Dienerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18023896525045293777noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2660089177097719300.post-51594694166595430662013-07-19T17:59:42.366-07:002013-07-19T17:59:42.366-07:00I posted in the original thread about some boys ha...I posted in the original thread about some boys harassing me in my boyfriend's presence. I never expected him to intervene. I don't think that's a fair expectation, especially given what I knew about his physical capabilities.<br /><br />But it is very fair for me to have expected him to at least shut up and stay invisible rather than giving them a hand by hissing at me that I should be polite to them, feel pretty, and emoathize with them because they can't "have" me.<br /><br />Men don't have to attempt to rescue me; it's their own choice. But they better'd damn well get out of my way when I deal with my predicament myself.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06575902449982773635noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2660089177097719300.post-89954069672982471802013-07-19T14:05:17.865-07:002013-07-19T14:05:17.865-07:00I saw it because I get an email each time someone ...I saw it because I get an email each time someone comments, but I'm actually also happy you double posted it here because that link is WONDERFUL and it would be a shame to have it buried some six hundred comments deep.Chris Brecheenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07819138776404280633noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2660089177097719300.post-23478926256288734892013-07-19T13:58:32.435-07:002013-07-19T13:58:32.435-07:00This is a repeat comment - but I feel had to make ...This is a repeat comment - but I feel had to make sure you saw this Chris.<br /><br />Your story is an amazing story. Thank you for sharing, and thank you for speaking out and helping her. Too few men do this, and stay silent. <br /><br />I also want to share Jackson Katz's amazing TED talk on this very issue [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ElJxUVJ8blw] - it's a worthwhile 17 mins to watch the video. Your story is an excellent example of his call to action for men to speak out and stand with women (i.e. starting at 16:27 minute mark in the video). <br /><br />Again - THANK YOU for your courage!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2660089177097719300.post-4919244866195539872013-07-19T11:14:39.434-07:002013-07-19T11:14:39.434-07:00I've been thinking a lot lately about how to c...I've been thinking a lot lately about how to change a number of disturbing behaviors in society. Creeps on the bus. Drivers being jerks to cyclists. All sorts of things like that. <br /><br />As much as I believe women (including myself) can and should feel empowered to stand up for ourselves and call out this action when they see it, sometimes the best pressure is pressure from people the perpetrators think are like them. Every time I (as a cyclist) flip off a driver who cut me off, they think - man, cyclists are jerks. If their passenger yells at them, they may think harder about doing it next time. And I think it's the same with street/public transit harassment. Your "bro, back off, you're being a creep", in the mind of the creep, is probably worth a hundred female "fuck offs" in terms of impact. Elliehttp://www.elliejerow.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2660089177097719300.post-3219809158527236422013-07-19T09:33:34.406-07:002013-07-19T09:33:34.406-07:00There are times and places when even well-intentio...There are times and places when even well-intentioned sweethearts may be shooed away, but if you see the outpouring of comments that have happened on this story, you can see why that is. Not being able to read someone's body language that they're receptive or want to be left alone is socially inept and a bit unfortunate, but usually not treated with contempt. Not getting the hint when the person is looking around for escape routes and telling you they'd like to read their book is not a signal most people can misinterpret. However, it doesn't matter if you're the nicest, most well intentioned, totally-not-creepy guy in the world....some days a person just wants to read their book.Chris Brecheenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07819138776404280633noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2660089177097719300.post-26264540339484677322013-07-19T09:23:41.356-07:002013-07-19T09:23:41.356-07:00I will take a look. :) Thank you.I will take a look. :) Thank you.Chris Brecheenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07819138776404280633noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2660089177097719300.post-63315544583811913832013-07-19T07:15:59.280-07:002013-07-19T07:15:59.280-07:00To my general knowledge, if a woman wants to be ap...To my general knowledge, if a woman wants to be approached and gives that body language, she won't object to the regular old sweetheart :)Lonnie Rosehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15600011371246455594noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2660089177097719300.post-45179574105620363062013-07-19T07:12:54.469-07:002013-07-19T07:12:54.469-07:00I think I understand where Oaksong is coming from....I think I understand where Oaksong is coming from. The epidemic of bullying as presented in schools often involves a victim that is unsupported by the larger framework of both peers and adults. As such, the victim is forced into a role of being scared and weak, particularly in response to a verbal onslaught. It seems that unless a victim passively stands and is physically beaten, authority figures and peers are apt not to step in. <br /><br />In our adult society, I can see this train behavior being the extension of these bullies who have grown up. Although they have grown up, become interested in women and sexuality, etc. they still seem to rely on the helpless victim trope, where their superior physical presence and often greater patriarchal support are used to intimidate and bully the women (calling it a 'compliment').<br /><br />By the same token, those guys who were the subject of bullying and may be physically weaker may choose to be bystanders rather than actively thwarting these attempts out of fear, much like nearby women. <br /><br />Bottom line: if respect for other human beings (in whatever form) does not start young, it only has a propensity to get worse as people grow up. The difference is, adults can use excuses much more readily (being nice, compliments, etc) as a way of justifying the same juvenile disrespectful and bullying behavior. Lonnie Rosehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15600011371246455594noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2660089177097719300.post-50818400118518407812013-07-19T06:20:36.192-07:002013-07-19T06:20:36.192-07:00Chris, thanks for being a badass bystander!!!I won...Chris, thanks for being a badass bystander!!!I wonder if someone has already told you to check out Hollaback! They are an incredible grass roots organization whose mission is to end street harassment. As well as being a great resource for women/LGBTQ/any folk experiencing harassment, they ALSO have a list of ways witnesses of harassment can act to make harassment socially unacceptable/ help the person experiencing harassment, including telling them that what they are doing is GROSS. Here it is:<br /><br />http://www.ihollaback.org/resources/get-involved/Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com